ceemac

Shake It Baby...
Turkish Military
The Turkish military must be in tatters at the moment with everything that's going on.

It's hard to keep up with there's so much being reported daily in the press.

What's the feeling in Turkey - is this turning into a witch hunt and being a little exaggerated, or is it really as bad as what people are being told.

The other thing that crossed my mind was that this will really suit the government in power at the moment as they've never had a good relationship with the army.

I just wonder is it being deliberately over-egged?


C
 

Squeaky

Member
Turkish Military
Good afternoon:

Shirleyanntr - I would be most interested as to WHY you say to ignore anything in TodayZaman.

This is a link to the latest:

Yet another subversive plot against AK Party exposed

As to why this is not being reported in other online English papers I suspect these quotes from another column in the above paper MIGHT suggest an answer:

A new plan allegedly drafted by members of the military aiming to overthrow the government failed to find coverage on a number of newspapers and news broadcasters' Web sites, a fate previously faced by several similar plans.
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“Some of our colleagues are concerned that their names are also included on that list. That’s most probably why they turn a blind eye to the coup plan,” said one journalist speaking on the condition of anonymity.

The journalist also said recent debates over Turkey becoming an authoritarian country through “civilian tutelage” could stand as evidence for cooperation between journalists and the armed forces against the government.


“Some media circles are already working to foment chaos in the country through such claims. They are now afraid to see their names in the expected list,” the journalist added.

ceemac - If my reasoning is correct the forces opposed to AK Party made their views very plain from day one although it only came out into the open with the attempt to elect the president and the posting of the e-memo by TSK.

I personally find it hard to believe that all the allegations are true but at the same time who the heck committed all the unsolved murders in the past if it was not Ergenekon members and various clandestine groups.

Scary stuff if even a quarter of it is true.

Cheers

Squeaky
 

ceemac

Shake It Baby...
Turkish Military
The papers I'd be reading are Todays Zaman, Hurriyet Daily News, Sabah, and Anadolu Ajansi.

They all have varying degrees of coverage of this issue, Today's Zaman having by far the most.

You do have to take into account that there may be sides taken just as with our own press, and it's trying to interpret yourself what exactly is going on that is difficult from afar.


C
 

richelm

Member
Turkish Military
Throughout Turkey's history the people have turned to the military to protect them from unscrupulous party politicians.
The current government challenged the military by calling the last election after the military made subtle interventions. They then grew in confidence following a landslide victory and seized the opportunity to divide and conquer in what we now have to tolerate in their daily propaganda machine using the case of Ergenekon.
A government that likes to flex its new found power by playing the international stage, selling off national assets and increasing taxes whilst creating little long term employment growth and ignoring the outstretched arm of foreign assistance in the form of investment and IMF support is either balls out confident of a rosy future or believe in there own largely self-controlled press and media.
Only time will tell but I believe we are in for one hell of a rocky ride if the AKP win a third term at next years elections.
 
Turkish Military
İ cant beieve that anybody living in Turkey and interested in its politics would be so naive as to believe wholesale anything the Zaman had to say in regards to the Military and the Ak party. this is an extremely right wing paper.
 

Squeaky

Member
Turkish Military
Good evening:

Shirleyanntr: Am I to assume that your latest post is meant to explain your reason for writting that TodayZaman should be ignored? Didn't realize you were a politician because your respond would do a politician proud - a comment containing a veiled insult/put down rather than the answer requested.

At the same time you would do naive people such as I a great service if you would take a bit of time and point out news articles in the TodayZaman that have been presented more accurately in some of other paper. I suspect that you will have difficulty finding much concerning Ergenekon in any other papers for the same reason the latest coup plot is barely mentioned in other papers as mentioned in earlier post.

Please see this link: Media Landscape - Turkey - European Journalism Centre which identifies TodayZaman as liberal and left-wing - not right wing.

richelm: To which party politicians are you referring when you say the people turn to the military to protect them?

I don't understand how the Ergenekon trials could be called a propaganda machine considering it is being conducted under a constitution and laws put in place by the military. Are you suggesting that the AK Party are controlling/directing the judges conducting this trial?

Re Foreign assistance and IMF support: please see this link concerning Foreign Direct Investment -

End of 2009: Turkey saying goodbye to IMF?

“Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan was ‘smart’ not to sign an International Monetary Fund [IMF] stand-by agreement.”
This remark belongs to Professor Steve Hanke of The Johns Hopkins University department of applied economics and is shared by more people in Turkey today. Looking at the current picture, comments suggesting that a deal with the fund is no longer -- and should not be -- on Turkey’s agenda, as the country has left the worst of crisis behind, are heard more and more often even among business circles that were keen to see a deal.


Re Foreign Direct Investment - please see Foreign Direct Investment (FDI) Statistics
Investment was up by 22.2 per cent in the last year shown after rises of 1.1 in 2002 (the year AKP were elected), 1.8 in 2003, 2.8 in 2004, 10.0 in 2005, 20.0 in 2006. Hardly an indication that foreigners are afraid of the AKP.

Re- their own largely self-controlled press and media - the Dogan Media Group owns over 52 % of the media in Turkey so don't understand which outlets you are referring to as AKP controlled.

Cheers

Squeaky
 
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Turkish Military
i cant get the link to work..but if you google between fact and fantasy you should get the report that Gareth H. Jenkins has written for Silk road Studies
 

Squeaky

Member
Turkish Military
Good evening:

Shirleyanntr: As mentioned above one of the references I got from Google indicated that the Zaman journalists are considered to be right wing – I don’t have much understanding of right or left wings so have to go with the information in the link I posted.

I have read a number of articles by Gareth Jenkins and seen columns in which he was mentioned. I tried to find out just who this man was and what his background was without any great luck.

I can't get the Silkroad links to work tonight but believe I read them earlier which might have been what got me interested in Jenkins in the first place. I think it is important to point out that this is a blog - not a newspaper.

Interesting link: The Ergenekon case and The New York Times story by AYDOÄžAN VATANDAÅž* I think this article was discussing a supposedly slanted article in Hurriyet. It contains the following paragraphs among others.

It is explicitly noticed that the informants of The New York Times reporter are entirely biased about the trial; a British writer, Gareth Jenkins, who doesn’t hide his close relations with Ergenekon proponents; Aysel Çelikel, the president of a controversial charity; and a Turkish journalist, Nedim Şener, who has been known for his extreme ideas about the Ergenekon case from the beginning. Şener is also part of Uğur Dündar’s senior team at the Star TV newsroom and Dündar is also well known for his opposition to the case.
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It was interesting to note that while the Hürriyet newspaper quoted from The New York Times story, it only highlighted the opinions of the British journalist, Gareth Jenkins, as if to convince its readers about the credibility and objectivity of The New York Times’ version. Every single person in Turkey knows quite well where the other informants of The New York Times stand.

If Gareth Jenkins is/was getting and reporting from information provided by the men mentioned above it would suggest that his report was not exactly middle of the road.

The following is a bit of background of these three men:

Aysel Çelikel mentioned above became the President of Association for Support of Contemporary Living (ÇYDD) when the former President, who had been arrested with almost the first bunch as suspects in Ergenekon, died. Would suggest that he might not exactly been a fan of the AKP - birds of a feather and all that.

Nedim Şener is or was a reporter for Milliyet which is part of the Dogan Media Group so hardly unbiased considering the relationship Aydin Dogan has with the AKP.

Uğur Dündar works for Star TV which is part of the Dogan Media Group so that hardly makes him an unbiased observer

Will be interesting to see which journalists are exposed by the Taraf newspaper as being mentioned as “helpers” for the latest coup exposure and which were slated to be arrested. I really hope these names are published as it will help determine which to trust and which not to trust.

Cheers

Squeaky
 

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