goranbockman
Member
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
Words fail me. Ignorant Mullahs have corrupted, to the core, the religion that gave women the rights of a modern society, 1300 years before the West! This is all the doing of those damned Hadith, a bunch of drivel and hogwash!! 
pineapple1
I Love Kleopatra Beach !
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
whoever gave this poor girl the lashes should be burned at the stake , for assulting her !!! just desserts for such inhuman people ................Diane
janeanneteacake
Member
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
It doesnt surprise me at all. Rape victims in such conservative places, such as in the East of Turkey also, are often killed (nowadays called suicide?) because in their eyes they are spoiled goods and bring shame to the family.
ted j
Member
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
Totally agree Zuber i don't want putting in a bad mood
kevin4faber
Member
ceemac
Shake It Baby...
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
I always imagined that there is a natural mechanism in the human species that indicates right from wrong.
There are of course evil people who know they are doing wrong but enjoy it and don't give a damn in any case.
Surely to God these Muslim elders must have something somewhere in them that's screaming 'this isn't right'?
Or am I just totally naive?
C
There are of course evil people who know they are doing wrong but enjoy it and don't give a damn in any case.
Surely to God these Muslim elders must have something somewhere in them that's screaming 'this isn't right'?
Or am I just totally naive?
C
janeanneteacake
Member
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
I used to believe this too but after living in a different culture you slowly start to realise and accept that this is not so. Its like what we call 'common sense'...in the Uk this phrase is used a lot and although there is a Turkish word for it (sağduyu)its not used so much and certainly not like we use it in everyday conversation. It doesnt quite have the same meaning.
Ive studied a little sociology and a sociologist would probably point to the fact that in these conservative developing and undeveloped countries they never went through the industrial revolution that Europe did...and the fight for equalities, workers rights, womens rights or whatever. (Yes Turkish women had the right to vote a long time ago but they were GIVEN it by Ataturk...they didnt have to fight for it, this makes a difference in the collective consciousness of a nation). What we cannot comprehend coming from European cultures is the sheer WEIGHT of social, cultural and traditional pressure...and it is truly HUGE. It is so huge that such crimes as this and
the so called 'honour' killings, are seen and truly believed to be right.
That natural mechanism, if it does exist, I would argue is all too easily muffled, destroyed even, by society.
I used to believe this too but after living in a different culture you slowly start to realise and accept that this is not so. Its like what we call 'common sense'...in the Uk this phrase is used a lot and although there is a Turkish word for it (sağduyu)its not used so much and certainly not like we use it in everyday conversation. It doesnt quite have the same meaning.
Ive studied a little sociology and a sociologist would probably point to the fact that in these conservative developing and undeveloped countries they never went through the industrial revolution that Europe did...and the fight for equalities, workers rights, womens rights or whatever. (Yes Turkish women had the right to vote a long time ago but they were GIVEN it by Ataturk...they didnt have to fight for it, this makes a difference in the collective consciousness of a nation). What we cannot comprehend coming from European cultures is the sheer WEIGHT of social, cultural and traditional pressure...and it is truly HUGE. It is so huge that such crimes as this and
the so called 'honour' killings, are seen and truly believed to be right.
That natural mechanism, if it does exist, I would argue is all too easily muffled, destroyed even, by society.
Yalides
Am I pretty ?
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
For what these people do you would get locked up in Europe for being child abusers. It,s the same.
For what these people do you would get locked up in Europe for being child abusers. It,s the same.
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
Obviously its nowhere near on the same scale but for a starting point to show how difference in traditions and culture can be viewed very differently----
Elderly People
Many in Turkey find that the Western norm of having old folks homes is abhorrent. Turkish friends of mine find it despicable that it is totally normal for us that we have places that the elderly are sent to rather than kept and looked after by the family regardless of condition and health.
I know its not a direct parallel but its an example of how some see practices as unacceptable whilst another culture sees it as normal
Elderly People
Many in Turkey find that the Western norm of having old folks homes is abhorrent. Turkish friends of mine find it despicable that it is totally normal for us that we have places that the elderly are sent to rather than kept and looked after by the family regardless of condition and health.
I know its not a direct parallel but its an example of how some see practices as unacceptable whilst another culture sees it as normal
SuperBogs
I miss you Pebble
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
I follow you Philip and really respect that Turks have MUCH stronger family values then westernized cultures. That being said, even us putting our elderly in senior homes cannot be compared to innocent people being lashed or honor killings. Often these senior homes offer better services and care then we can give at home.
Bob
I follow you Philip and really respect that Turks have MUCH stronger family values then westernized cultures. That being said, even us putting our elderly in senior homes cannot be compared to innocent people being lashed or honor killings. Often these senior homes offer better services and care then we can give at home.
Bob
kevin4faber
Member
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
I take the point Philip,
I don't think we are bad, far from it, but we sure as hell ain't perfect either. Although it is easy to take the moral high ground on an issue such as this where it is obvious (to us) that a huge injustice has been dealt to the young girl, when the perpetrator was given a pardon. There are other areas such as the example you gave of care for the family, by the family, which we dismiss as not being possible. Largely, I suspect, because we are too busy!
It's a funny old world with some funny old ways. Is it better now than when Grandad was a kid? I don't know, but in some places it is exactly the same and they still manage perfectly well! Are we right and they are wrong? I don't know. I think that what happened to the young girl and the way she was treated was disgraceful! But, am I right?
I take the point Philip,
I don't think we are bad, far from it, but we sure as hell ain't perfect either. Although it is easy to take the moral high ground on an issue such as this where it is obvious (to us) that a huge injustice has been dealt to the young girl, when the perpetrator was given a pardon. There are other areas such as the example you gave of care for the family, by the family, which we dismiss as not being possible. Largely, I suspect, because we are too busy!
It's a funny old world with some funny old ways. Is it better now than when Grandad was a kid? I don't know, but in some places it is exactly the same and they still manage perfectly well! Are we right and they are wrong? I don't know. I think that what happened to the young girl and the way she was treated was disgraceful! But, am I right?
Lemonhead
Devil's Advocacy LLC
Rape Victim Lashed For Being Pregnant
As much as I don't agree with any part of this story to the point of finding it almost unbelievable, we should remember that our customs and beliefs do not and should not apply to everyone. There isn't a "one size fits all" type of law and regulation that transcends cultural boundries.
I have yet to see anybody ask any questions about the things not covered in the story that I found asking myself. Such as: what, if any, do their local laws or customs require in rape cases from the victim? Why didn't she go to anybody? (a parent, a relative, not only the authorities) So for me to say that because "we" would handle it this way and that is the right way is a pretty bold statement that I'm not comfortable with.
Let's use Phillip's Nursing Home analogy as a starting point. I thought of the administering medications and drugs. Drugs! Hmm. Use of illegal narcotics is prevalent in western societies. We even provide free needles and other services to our junkies. The number of deaths, injuries, illnesses, crimes...directly associated with this is undebatable. Is this a result of that term we love to use so loosley called progress. I wonder how the people in this story would view our laws and punishments regarding this one?
I know. I know. I can hear it now. "But raping a girl isn't the same as..." The point is, our laws are not the same nor should our values be forced upon someone else without giving the same respect to the other side to examine and critique our own legal, moral, and social system.
I have yet to see anybody ask any questions about the things not covered in the story that I found asking myself. Such as: what, if any, do their local laws or customs require in rape cases from the victim? Why didn't she go to anybody? (a parent, a relative, not only the authorities) So for me to say that because "we" would handle it this way and that is the right way is a pretty bold statement that I'm not comfortable with.
Let's use Phillip's Nursing Home analogy as a starting point. I thought of the administering medications and drugs. Drugs! Hmm. Use of illegal narcotics is prevalent in western societies. We even provide free needles and other services to our junkies. The number of deaths, injuries, illnesses, crimes...directly associated with this is undebatable. Is this a result of that term we love to use so loosley called progress. I wonder how the people in this story would view our laws and punishments regarding this one?
I know. I know. I can hear it now. "But raping a girl isn't the same as..." The point is, our laws are not the same nor should our values be forced upon someone else without giving the same respect to the other side to examine and critique our own legal, moral, and social system.
