Managing agent for Sunflower
Has everyone seen this proposal? (My reply comes first, BTW)

Hi Doug,
I’m not sure that we need to take over the management of the complex. I think that Turkey can be a legal minefield for the inexperienced and that Oracle have both the experience and buying power to get good deals.

I think that what we need to do is set up a service level agreement with Oracle, specifying what needs to be done and when. We should get accounts for Sunflower showing how much they receive in management fees and how much they spend on maintenance, and we should have the right to audit these accounts, though I hope we don’t have to. I think we should follow the Australian model for complex management where we elect a management committee from the owners and mandate them to negotiate on our behalf, and I think we should set up a “sinking fund”. The sinking fund would cost the owners a set amount each year, a relatively small amount, say £20 or £30 and this would be paid into a bank account that could only be spent by the management committee and it builds up to cover major repairs in 10-20 years time, like repairing the swimming pool, fixing the roof, etc. ( The sinking fund would be like a trust account, need 3 signatories, etc, usual protection to make sure the money is safe and earning a bit of interest.)

That’s my 2 pence worth – let me know what you think.


Hefin Thomas

From: doug pickering
Sent: 15 July 2009 19:52
Subject: Sunflower Management Takeover

My name is Doug Pickering. I own A7 Sunflower Apartment and I have done so for 4 years. I currently live in Whitby, N Yorks with my partner Jane.
Like a lot of people we have had dealings with Oracle which have been both good and bad. It started me thinking that maybe it was time to consider starting our own management of Sunflower complex. I approached a local solicitor to find out if it is legally possible to do this, and have since found out that it is possible, providing all owners are in agreeance with this.
Firstly on the 26th of June I had a formal meeting with Izzet Donmez who is managing director of Oracle. His response was that he would be more than happy for us as owners to take over management of our own complex. In the meeting we discussed certain conditions;
1. Painting of external walls of complex, which Oracle have promised and yet has not been done.
2. General cleaning i.e. stairways of blocks, recreation areas and gym toilets and showers in that area.
On the 3rd of July I arranged another meeting which Izzet Donmez, this time with my solictior Yardi Yucel, to discuss the legal process of taking on the management of Sunflower Complex. We discussed the same issues as before, his response was that if the walls were to be painted that he would have to continue manageing the complex for another 3 years, to receive enough payments to cover the cost. He said that there was no money available for any maintenance work. We insisted that there should be enough money to cover any outstanding maintenance work including the painting. He suggested that we contacted all complex owners and if they are in aggreeance for taking over then he will decide whether to paint or not. He agreed to give all the email addresses of owners, he gave me this list of the 6th of July.
Legally in Turkey we have to have a manager to oversee the running of the complex. The manager has the responsablity of general running of the complex, overseeing contract work and managing the payments for maintenance work. More importantly that the owners are getting value for money and seeing that their maintenance payments are giving them a better service.
If everyone is in agreeance I would like to take on the responsiblility of manager for sunflower complex. I would move and live in Turkey, which would allow me to oversee all aspects of the running of the complexand represent the owners.
As manager I would;
1. Oversee running of complex,
2. Hire our own security guards, who I would also suggest could take on the gardening to make more use of their time and save us money.
3. Hire cleaners to do cleaning of stairways of blocks and toilets, showers and gym area.
4. Pool maintenance,
5. Renting of the pool side bar to ensure continued income for the complex,
6. In reguards to the bus serivce, for the little use it gets I do not think that it is viable to pay for this service, although if anyone wishes to keep this service running we will have to look into arranging prices for bus and driver etc.
7. Legally there has to be a contract between owners to decide what needs to be done and how to run the complex, for example, only owners, or if they rent their appartment, their clients can use the swimming pool and complex.
8. There will be a penalty payment for late payment of maintenance monies.
9. Hire a solictor to deal with legal issues.

Legal process
Owners should have a formal meeting with a government representative present to decide on issues related to the complex. Voting to elect manager for the complex. To elect two persons to oversee the managers responabilities as agreed by law. In our case it is impossible to get everybody together at one time, so we will have to go to court and a judge will decide about who will manage and oversee the complex. Now it will be your turn to decide who will manage the complex, Oracle or Owners.
If we take over the running of the complex would everybody be happy for me to take on the managment role, alternatively choose somebody else, also who will be the overseers.
My personal thoughts are, I feel we would give ourselves a far better service by running our own complex, and for the money we have given Oracle in maintenance payments over the last 4 years, we've recieved very little in return, and there certainly should be money in the pot for painting and other maintenance work.
If you have any thoughts or suggestions about this process to let me know by contacting me by email, mobile phone or land line.

Regards Doug Pickering A7 Sunflower.
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Managing agent for Sunflower
Havıng just got a new manager for our sıte,be very carefull as ıts not an easy thıng to take on! and ıf Mr Pıckerıng wants to be the overall manager good luck to hım as gettıng a work permıt for thıs type of job would be well nıgh ımpossıble.but good luck what ever you do. Jım
Managing agent for Sunflower
We received this email but believe that Doug should have spoken to us before going ahead to seek advice and talk to Izzet. We have not had any problems with Oracle and are happy with their service so have no intention to 'take over' the complex. Lets hope his comments to Izzet are not reflected badly on the rest of us! After talking to others it seems that they feel the same way and as he needs the backing of every apartment it looks like this will not go ahead anyway.


Managing agent for Sunflower
I agree I am not to happy for anyone to go and speak to Izzet on our behalf, without our permission.
If this was to have been a discussion and we was all given an opportunity to give our opinions and they was all like minded then we could have appointed someone to represent.
But as we can see with the emails that have been going around this is not the wish of us all.
If I have any problems I contact oracle myself and things are sorted, I don't have a problem with them. I have heard many horror stories from other people over the last 3 years with different builders, and all I can say is thank goodness we bought with oracle.
I have emailed oracle and will be out there on the 28th Juy so will go into the office to confirm.

Lets hope that no one else represents us with out the full backing of every owner at the sunflower in future.

Diane and Toney
Managing agent for Sunflower
I also have no complaints about Oracle, but its not a bad idea to have a service agreement showing what is covered and what is excluded. I think it would avoid these debates about whether painting was included and how often it should be done.

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The Carnwath Massive
Managing agent for Sunflower
do you not have a committee to manage the management company and auditors to oversee them spending your money ?
I thought you had to according to Law 634 even if you employ a management company.



The Carnwath Massive
Managing agent for Sunflower
there are references to it on the forum, I understand there is a generic document that outlines the set up of a site and its management, for instance who do the people who take your money answer too ? who audits their spending ? might be worth you contacting Celtic for advice



Managing agent for Sunflower
can i just add that oracle have told us they are pulling out of our villa site(primrose)
feel totally let down by them,
remember that the curtsy bus etc will stop,
so you need to be careful of agreeing to anything.


Managing agent for Sunflower
Primrose Villas

This sounds very worrying - did they give any reasons, notice etc?


New Member
Managing agent for Sunflower
To all sunflower apartment owners;
Those who took the time to reply to my email, thank you.
Due to the responses that i have received, the management of the complex will continue to be run by Oracle. My intention was purely to ensure that our annual maintenance payments were being spent where they should be, and to make sure our investments were being looked after.
Many thanks,
Doug Pickering. A7 Sunflower.

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