enoch

Member
Coronavirus
Hils... I think the rules after lockdown for supermarkets etc will go back to normal, but the lockdown has given an excuse for Central Govt to have more control and blackmail opportunities over the opposition Party Municipalities on the Tourism coast.
The new Laws & Regs will allow the Government appointed Governors, & Police to have the last say on who is given an alcohol licence, and where the Bar & Restaurant will be allowed to be sited... Which will good for any pro Govt developers & restaurant owners .. As on the Coast the more Liberal Party led Municipalities had a free hand and choice ...
All joking aside its not a bad idea there are to many bars and restaurants.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
I hope this is put into evidence, in this new enquiry into the handling of the Pandemic ... by Boris Government...

The smoking gun on the decanting of Covid patients from Hospital into Care Homes who didn't have the isolation facilities or enough PPE in April 2020 in a Government pdf



EX7-Ii-CQWs-AEgy-RG.jpg
 

Kanga

Member
Coronavirus
There's going to be a lot to cover in this inquiry. Don't forget that a government inquiry is to determine lessons to be learned from actions and decisions made during the pandemic. It is NOT a forum for finding blame and scapegoats. We want to learn from mistakes.
We could learn a lot from the air industry on this; they have a reporting system for any problems which is totally non-fault finding and that way anyone can report any problem without fear or favour. It obviously works because flying is about the safest mode of transport.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
The Government Inquiry "It is NOT a forum for finding blame" Why not Kanga ? if negligence is proven why shouldn't victims families see justice for their loss ?

If manslaughter by gross negligence or misconduct in public office or other any other offences can be proven why shouldn't people brought to book ..

If we take the example of The Hillsborough Inquiry.... Although it took time and public pressure .... In June 2017, six people were charged with the offences listed above , if Police and public officials .... and those owning Business can be charged for negligence.

Example if a Businessman were to send staff into situations without protective gear can be brought to book and justice dispensed , then why can't people who make and implement Govt policy ? ... like this decanting of live Covid cases into Care Homes, many with no isolation facilities, some with hardly any PPE , and some not even supplied at all, by the Govt .. resulting in needless deaths ...

We had similar to your flying example with a report and with lessons to be learned written up .

With the Cygnus Pandemic Simulation, it was to learn lessons on reactions ..,to test the NHS and health authorities and Government reactions and policy they would take in times of crisis ..

The conclusions, findings and lessons learned from this simulation and for the Tory Government to implement were Ignored ....

The simulation showed what actually came to pass in many cases , ... highlighting shortages of staff , intensive care beds, vital equipment , even mortuary space. All as said ignored, possibly due a failed Austerity policy... obviously nothing learned in decision and policymaking .... The findings were then buried when the Pandemic hit by this Government ... never to be published ( As far as I know ) .... isn't this gross negligence in public office ...

Back in April 2020 Labour was asking for it to be published...

 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
I think theres going to be inquiries worldwide & quite rightly so.
What was/is the acceptable death rate from any country not to look into what's gone wrong, what could've been done better & how to protect populations in the future.
 

Kanga

Member
Coronavirus

Camden​

The Government Inquiry "It is NOT a forum for finding blame" Why not Kanga ? if negligence is proven why shouldn't victims families see justice for their loss ?



Because that's the legal framework for an inquiry, nothing to do with me, you, or the Queen of Sheba etc. That's how it is. I thought you were sufficiently au fait with this kind of stuff.

If the inquiry determines that there has been a criminal action etc, it will refer the matter to relevant department. SFO anyone? Be nice to see them get a conviction for a change.
 

35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
I know what I've learnt from all of this.............what a pandemic actually is. Not a book, not a news report, not a film but the real deal.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus

Camden​

The Government Inquiry "It is NOT a forum for finding blame" Why not Kanga ? if negligence is proven why shouldn't victims families see justice for their loss ?



Because that's the legal framework for an inquiry, nothing to do with me, you, or the Queen of Sheba etc. That's how it is. I thought you were sufficiently au fait with this kind of stuff.

If the inquiry determines that there has been a criminal action etc, it will refer the matter to relevant department. SFO anyone? Be nice to see them get a conviction for a change.



Its seems I am in part au fait with this kinda stuff, as you are, in part... It is for finding and determining blame as I said, but you are right after report and recommendations it will be up to the to the Government to pass it on .... so lets hope its televised or in the public domain not buried like the Cygnus Pandemic Simulation report and recommendations buried ... so the people whose relatives that have passed see justice if Govt negligence is determined ...

What is a public inquiry?

A public inquiry is a major investigation, launched by the government.
Its job is to respond to "public concern" about a particular event or set of events - such as the pandemic.
According to a leading specialist lawyer, it must ask three questions:
  • What happened?
  • Why did it happen and who is to blame?
  • What can be done to prevent it happening again?
An inquiry has the power to make people appear as witnesses, and to provide documentation and material evidence.
At the end, the public inquiry usually draws up a report and makes recommendations to the government.
Previous high-profile public inquiries have included investigations into the UK's role in the Iraq war, the events of "Bloody Sunday" in Northern Ireland and the phone-hacking scandal.

 

Kanga

Member
Coronavirus
Its seems I am in part au fait with this kinda stuff, as you are, in part... It is for finding and determining blame as I said, but you are right after report and recommendations it will be up to the to the Government to pass it on .... so lets hope its televised or in the public domain not buried like the Cygnus Pandemic Simulation report and recommendations buried ... so the people whose relatives that have passed see justice if Govt negligence is determined ...

What is a public inquiry?

A public inquiry is a major investigation, launched by the government.
Its job is to respond to "public concern" about a particular event or set of events - such as the pandemic.
According to a leading specialist lawyer, it must ask three questions:
  • What happened?
  • Why did it happen and who is to blame?
  • What can be done to prevent it happening again?
An inquiry has the power to make people appear as witnesses, and to provide documentation and material evidence.
At the end, the public inquiry usually draws up a report and makes recommendations to the government.
Previous high-profile public inquiries have included investigations into the UK's role in the Iraq war, the events of "Bloody Sunday" in Northern Ireland and the phone-hacking scandal.

Well, there you are then, you answered your own question!
I heard a shocking statistic this morning that India has lost more than a MILLION to the virus already this year, which is still not 5 months old.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
Yes I did . And it seems also your misguided statement, on public enquiry quote "It is NOT a forum for finding blame"...

it happens to us all.... as seen I thought in a public enquiry if blame found i.e. negligence it would lead to charges laid against those blamed .... but it seems, it's up to those possibly found in the report negligent the Government, itself will decide where it goes next... what a farce... those policed policing themselves.


 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Lockdowns, vaccinations.
Judging by the dramatic drop in UK Covid related deaths.....vaccines here are the winners of the day.
It takes time to get out of the hundreds table but it will happen for all countries. Turkey is certainly not the worst of the worst on daily infections and deaths in Europe. Figures are fluctuating all the time.
 

IbrahimAbi

Grey wisdom
Coronavirus

Kanga

Member
Coronavirus
Yes I did . And it seems also your misguided statement, on public enquiry quote "It is NOT a forum for finding blame"...

it happens to us all.... as seen I thought in a public enquiry if blame found i.e. negligence it would lead to charges laid against those blamed .... but it seems, it's up to those possibly found in the report negligent the Government, itself will decide where it goes next... what a farce... those policed policing themselves.


No actually, it depends on the type of enquiry. There's more than one. Each has a different purpose and outcome.

" . . .A call for a public inquiry is common where an event of major public concern has happened or a controversial policy has been enacted or gone wrong. There are different ways in which an Inquiry can be set up: Cabinet Office guidance does not presume one or another is preferable. • Three types of possible inquiry.

A statutory inquiry: set up and operates under the rules of the Inquiries Act 2005 and the Inquiry Rules 2006 – for example: Grenfell, Blood Inquiry, IICSA. Also powers in other Acts to have public inquiries – - s3 of the Children Act 2004 – Inquiry to be carried out by the Children’s Commissioner : - s14 of the Health and Safety at Work Act (incidents and accidents) - S68-72 of the Financial Services Act 2012 (serious failure of regulatory system) - Merchant Shipping Act 2005 (deaths/serious incidents) . - Schedule 1 of the Coroners Act 2009 enables inquests to be converted into Inquiries under the 2005 Act. • A non statutory inquiry: this includes “ad hoc” inquiries, committees of Privy Counsellors or Royal Commissions : the Chilcot Inquiry is the most recent of these – earlier example - Profumo. • Third type: Parliamentary Commissions of Inquiry. . ."

With thanks to https://www.landmarkchambers.co.uk/...-managing-a-request-from-a-public-inquiry.pdf

The fact remains that until this government runs out of credible deniability and there is a seriously electable opposition, Bojo will run rings round Parliament.
I was amused to hear Prof Mary Beard say recently that because Bojo is a classicist he considers himself a Roman emperor rather than an elected politician. However, this is digressing, so back to topic.!
 

35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Coronavirus
AstraZeneca vaccine 97 percent effective against Indian Covid variant says new study.

THE ASTRAZENECA vaccine has faced scrutiny in recent months for its links to blood clots. But some good news relating to the vaccine has now emerged - a new study has shown it to be 97 percent effective against the Indian Covid variant, the strain currently causing concern in the UK. The AstraZeneca Covid vaccine is 97 percent effective against the Indian variant, according to a study published by the Indraprastha Apollo Hospital in Delhi. The research involved nearly 3,300 people in India and discovered only two hospitalisations with Covid.

All the participants were vaccinated with the AstraZeneca jab and they worked in healthcare. The findings also included a hospital admission rate of less than 1 percent. Dr Anupam Sibal, group medical director, said: “Our study demonstrated that 97.38 per cent of those vaccinated were protected from an infection." The Indian Covid variant is now spreading in the UK and appears to be passed on as easily as the Kent variant that now dominates UK infections.

Health secretary Matt Hancock has said the Indian variant can “spread even faster” than the Kent variant and is “becoming the dominant strain in some parts of the country” such as Bolton and Blackburn.
But in Bolton, where a number of people have ended up in hospitals with the Indian variant, the “vast majority” of those patients have been eligible for a Covid vaccine but had not yet had one, Mr Hancock added. Sir Mark Walport, a member of Sage, said while vaccines still seemed to be protecting people from severe Covid cases they appeared less effective at stopping transmission of the Indian variant. The deputy chair of the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI), Professor Anthony Harnden, told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme: “The vaccines may be less effective against mild disease but we don't think they're less effective against severe disease.
 
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