35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Are you now speaking for the people of Continental Europe ? do they know they have a Brexiteer anti eu sceptic representative speaking for them?

Unfortunately this sole worthwhile success, the vaccination roll out , that you and your own Govt of choice are now it seems basking in, a success which isn't even solely theirs, but in part the work of the overworked Health Service personnel , military and volunteers.

With this success you want to beat down on the EU with some petty comparison on their actions, even though on different timelines, circumstances and vaccination start.

Unfortunately this Govt sole success to speak on, will neither soothe the hurt of the people that have suffered from the Govt missteps nor will it unfortunately bring back loved ones to families of those who have passed, due to this same Govt's mishandling of the Pandemic ...

EU has made it's mistakes but at least their people have heard some apologies from the top eg von der Leyen .... something we Brits have never heard from our Leaders for their mistakes and mishandling ... from the likes of Boris , Hancock , Gavin Williamson etc

An anti EU stance doesn’t equate to anti Europe or the people who live there.
Your Labour activist petticoat is showing again......moan and complain about anything and everything.
Of course you can rip into all Conservative actions but TBF the Labour Party has nothing to offer the electorate & if they did....they’re a bit short on votes to implement anything.

I think the proofs in the pudding that the UK made the right move on going it alone. I also think it would’ve been a different scenario altogether if the UK were still members. The pressure would’ve been put on us to follow the circus that unfolded. Certainly the case if Starmer had been in charge.
 
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Camden

Member
Coronavirus
Camden,
The vote was cast, the voters had their say and rightly or wrongly depending on your opinion, Brexit got the democratic approval.
Now, after all the wrangling, the UK is no longer part of the EU in principle, even if it hasn't completely broken away.
I'm sure there will be further wrangles and hassle along the way but the result isn't going to be reversed, there won't be another referendum and you might as well accept it.
Anyway, why stress over an experiment that will probably have imploded within 5 years or so?
BTW - For all the balls ups during the pandemic, the early procurement of the vaccines, their distribution and the actual numbers vaccinated have gone very well and much much better than the EU countries.
Simple facts.

I don't think I mentioned the Brexit vote, nor the outcome, and have accepted the UK is no longer part of the EU ...not denied and not in my replies to Chips ....

My difference of opinion with Chips is we have left, so why the need to constantly snipe on an organisation we aren't partnered with and is one of our biggest trading partners ..wishing ill by criticism is dumb ,if it has problems its reflected in their economy and in consequence trade to and from us ...

So Chips stupid comparison and knocking of something that happened in a different time line and under different circumstances seems inane. Especially hypocritical from ( Chips) who has never called out any of the faults of our own Governments handling of the Pandemic that has led to one of the higher infection rates and one of the largest death rate in Europe, or its Covid enrichment through nepotism and dropping of tendering on Covid contracts , seems hypocritical to call out others in the EU on its roll out .... glass houses come to mind.

The Eu has itself has been self critical of it's roll out and apologised ... something we have never heard from our own Govts mishandling of the Pandemic not even once ...
 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
To constantly snipe at the EU hasn’t yet been deemed to be a crime. AND considering I own a property inside the EU, i’l snipe and say what I like as and when I see fit.
I know this Camden, unfortunately we can’t bring back the dead but because of the UKs actions now, we can quite possibly save some other folk facing the same fate.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
To constantly snipe at the EU hasn’t yet been deemed to be a crime. AND considering I own a property inside the EU, i’l snipe and say what I like as and when I see fit.
I know this Camden, unfortunately we can’t bring back the dead but because of the UKs actions now, we can quite possibly save some other folk facing the same fate.
Who suggested it was a crime Chips ? must have missed that post ... you are more than welcome to snipe at the EU, as I have to show your Hypocrisy in doing so , having never once sniped at your Govt of choice on their mishandling of the Pandemic....

No, as you repeat what I have already said. you can't unfortunately bring back those who have passed ... but we can still get Justice for the families who mourn them , over the mishandling and negligence by this Government , and heard before your excuses of comparisons of other Countries, but the Brits didn't vote them in, the buck stops here in the UK ....

We are protecting ourselves with the vaccine, I have had nothing but praise for those involved and said so.... but don't feel the need to criticize other foreign Governments, on for once us having success, in our roll out .... and find people that do criticize as said are hypocrites, lf seen they have never once called out the mishandling of their own Government .
 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Who said it was a crime Chips ? must have missed that post ... you are more than welcome to snipe at the EU, as I have to show your Hypocrisy in doing so . having never once sniped at your Govt of choice of thier mishandling of the Pandemic....

No, as you repeat what I have already said. you can't unfortunately bring back those who have passed ... but we can still get Justice for the families who mourn them , over the mishandling and negligence by this Government , and heard before your excuses of comparisons of other Countries, but the Brits didn't vote them in, the buck stops there ....

We are protecting ourselves with the vaccine, I have had nothing but praise for those involved and said so.... but don't feel the need to criticize other foreign Governments, on for once us having success, in our roll out .... and find people that do criticize as said are hypocrites, lf as seen they have never once called out the mishandling of their own Government .

What do you somehow think that the Government is going to get done for manslaughter?
Starmer has backed the moves until AFTER the event. Not forgetting we would’ve been awaiting the EMAs decisions if again Starmer had been in charge, we would’ve ended up like the EU waiting not only for the green light on the Astra vaccine but also the Pfizer one as well.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
What do you somehow think that the Government is going to get done for manslaughter?
Starmer has backed the moves until AFTER the event. Not forgetting we would’ve been awaiting the EMAs decisions if again Starmer had been in charge, we would’ve ended up like the EU waiting not only for the green light on the Astra vaccine but also the Pfizer one as well.

Who mentioned manslaughter Chips ???

There is already cases going ahead eg Dr Cathy Gardner's on the death of her late father Michael Gibson and on behalf of the may vulnerable put at risk She has a case, which accuses the government of unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm, which has been filed at the High Court

Where Mr Justice Linden has granted the case permission to proceed to a full trial. Despite the best efforts of the Government and NHS to get the case thrown out the judge ruling... …

" My father was one of the thousands of vulnerable people who died in a care home during this pandemic. His death certificate says ‘probable COVID-19’ because he was not tested. The care home should have been a safe place, instead he was put at risk because of a government decision to discharge patients from hospitals with no regard for Coronavirus infection risk"

"It is very clear that, whatever Matt Hancock may have said, the residents of care homes were not provided with a protective ring. He knew they were the most at risk and yet he issued a policy that exposed them to the risk of losing their lives. Many did. My father did."


And it is just the start ....If the government were an employee it would have sacked for gross negligence.
 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Who mentioned manslaughter Chips ???

There is already cases going ahead eg Dr Cathy Gardner's on the death of her late father Michael Gibson and on behalf of the may vulnerable put at risk She has a case, which accuses the government of unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm, which has been filed at the High Court

Where Mr Justice Linden has granted the case permission to proceed to a full trial. Despite the best efforts of the Government and NHS to get the case thrown out the judge ruling... …

" My father was one of the thousands of vulnerable people who died in a care home during this pandemic. His death certificate says ‘probable COVID-19’ because he was not tested. The care home should have been a safe place, instead he was put at risk because of a government decision to discharge patients from hospitals with no regard for Coronavirus infection risk"

"It is very clear that, whatever Matt Hancock may have said, the residents of care homes were not provided with a protective ring. He knew they were the most at risk and yet he issued a policy that exposed them to the risk of losing their lives. Many did. My father did."


And it is just the start ....If the government were an employee it would have sacked for gross negligence.

So we can assume then that the German, French, Spanish, Italian etc Governments are all going to be in their respective Courts.
It’s a pandemic, Governments and scientists were caught out worldwide, both the afore mentioned followed someone and when it didn’t work tried their own way. PPE, ventilators, hospital beds ran out, just like now we see vaccines being scarce and sought by all.
As said, that’s a pandemic.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
So we can assume then that the German, French, Spanish, Italian etc Governments are all going to be in their respective Courts.
It’s a pandemic, Governments and scientists were caught out worldwide, both the afore mentioned followed someone and when it didn’t work tried their own way. PPE, ventilators, hospital beds ran out, just like now we see vaccines being scarce and sought by all.
As said, that’s a pandemic.

You seem happy as usual to apply foreign comparisons as an excuse, and more than happy to give criticism and point out foreign Governments alleged faults which is really the affair of their electorate not ours .......

but not once have we seen a post of criticism by you on our own Governments mishandling and negligence... The faults of other people's governments are their affair as said ... The mishandling by our Govt is our affair and where the Buck stops .... but from you SILENCE.... that is why I bring the Hypocrite claim .

As seen justice is being sought on our Govt for unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm and unfortunately death again silence by you ... it is those people and families who I care about first, the British electorate and the Government who is meant to be in charge of their welfare and health should be brought to book ....
 
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35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
You seem happy as usual to apply foreign comparisons as an excuse, and more than happy to give criticism and point out foreign Governments alleged faults which is really the affair of their electorate not ours .......

but not once have we seen a post of criticism by you on our own Governments mishandling and negligence... The faults of other people's governments are their affair as said ... The mishandling by our Govt is our affair and where the Buck stops .... but from you SILENCE.... that is why I bring the Hypocrite claim .

As seen justice is being sought on our Govt for unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm and unfortunately death again silence by you ... it is those people and families who I care about first, the British electorate and the Government who is meant to be in charge of their welfare and health should be brought to book ....

Where have I used foreign governments as an excuse? At the start of this pandemic in Europe everyone had their eyes on Italy, then Spain, all countries were either mirroring or slightly deviating from them. It was trial and error........every country made the errors & that includes the WHO.
 

Saoirse

Moderator
Coronavirus
Reluctant to get involved in this as its somewhat of a circular argument

Bottom line no government has covered themselves in glory in this

However what I find most disappointing is the fact that many EU governments were totally frustrated and indeed limited in their response to this - not by their own limitations- but by the horrendous ineptitude of the EUs handling of the vaccine procurement and distribution

Spain for example in most regions were able to allocate and 85% distribute vaccines ahead of agreed schedule- the disgraceful problem however was they ended up having nothing to distribute as EU failed utterly re supplies

That's not an anti or pro EU stance- just a very regrettable fact on the ground that EU utterly failed its member states on supplying the promised numbers of the vaccine
 

Andybutt

Member
Coronavirus
You seem happy as usual to apply foreign comparisons as an excuse, and more than happy to give criticism and point out foreign Governments alleged faults which is really the affair of their electorate not ours .......

but not once have we seen a post of criticism by you on our own Governments mishandling and negligence... The faults of other people's governments are their affair as said ... The mishandling by our Govt is our affair and where the Buck stops .... but from you SILENCE.... that is why I bring the Hypocrite claim .

As seen justice is being sought on our Govt for unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm and unfortunately death again silence by you ... it is those people and families who I care about first, the British electorate and the Government who is meant to be in charge of their welfare and health should be brought to book ....
1614851268197.png
 

35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Reluctant to get involved in this as its somewhat of a circular argument

Bottom line no government has covered themselves in glory in this

However what I find most disappointing is the fact that many EU governments were totally frustrated and indeed limited in their response to this - not by their own limitations- but by the horrendous ineptitude of the EUs handling of the vaccine procurement and distribution

Spain for example in most regions were able to allocate and 85% distribute vaccines ahead of agreed schedule- the disgraceful problem however was they ended up having nothing to distribute as EU failed utterly re supplies

That's not an anti or pro EU stance- just a very regrettable fact on the ground that EU utterly failed its member states on supplying the promised numbers of the vaccine

Agreed, all Governments were caught out. What death toll figure should be deemed to be a Governments failure in a pandemic?
I think citizens themselves never grasped how serious this virus was or was going to get, why? None of us had anything to compare it to. It only came home to me when the terrible footage was being shown from Lombardi, Italy.

The Commissions idea was a good one, purchase and distribute to all member states.......it was the execution of that idea that was the screw up.
 
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Kanga

Member
Coronavirus
Who mentioned manslaughter Chips ???

There is already cases going ahead eg Dr Cathy Gardner's on the death of her late father Michael Gibson and on behalf of the may vulnerable put at risk She has a case, which accuses the government of unlawfully exposing thousands of care home residents to serious harm, which has been filed at the High Court

Where Mr Justice Linden has granted the case permission to proceed to a full trial. Despite the best efforts of the Government and NHS to get the case thrown out the judge ruling... …

" My father was one of the thousands of vulnerable people who died in a care home during this pandemic. His death certificate says ‘probable COVID-19’ because he was not tested. The care home should have been a safe place, instead he was put at risk because of a government decision to discharge patients from hospitals with no regard for Coronavirus infection risk"

"It is very clear that, whatever Matt Hancock may have said, the residents of care homes were not provided with a protective ring. He knew they were the most at risk and yet he issued a policy that exposed them to the risk of losing their lives. Many did. My father did."


And it is just the start ....If the government were an employee it would have sacked for gross negligence.
. . . as should the entire 'mis'-management of the EU. But they wont be able to vote them out.
 

35pluschips

Member
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Initially the “big four” in the EU took on the procurement of vaccines & on paper they seemed to be well. Germany, France, The Netherlands and Italy then merged with the Commission, perhaps they have regrets over that move. Nonetheless, it’s now full on everywhere to get these vaccines into people’s arms.
The best comment I’ve heard is, “nobody is safe till everyone is safe”.
 

enoch

Member
Coronavirus
Warning for Bodrum
Don't be complacent. You could be closed down again.
 

enoch

Member
Coronavirus
Turkish infections have gone up over 2000 a day to 11500 for little testing. Is it getting what the uk just went through? Because it was 2 months behind getting the virus so is it the faze coming?. I came home from the hospital yesterday and everything is open in alanya and its classed as high risk.
 

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