Jaycey

African Refugee
Top Poster Of Month
Coronavirus
Cases: 1,325,841 Deaths: 25,596 Recovered: 1,159,311
GoodNews.jpg
Vaccines finally arrived here and first jabs given today.
 
Coronavirus
Showed a clip on the BBC about a vaccination centre somewhere in Belgium. It was geared up to deal with 500 people daily, 6 people had turned up......
There’s thousands and thousands of Oxford/Astra doses sitting in fridges right across Europe.......the virus must be laughing at that thought.
I’m also getting the feeling that some of the BAME community want to be vaccinated on their own doorsteps.
 

immac

Senior Member Has-Been
Coronavirus
Showed a clip on the BBC about a vaccination centre somewhere in Belgium. It was geared up to deal with 500 people daily, 6 people had turned up......
There’s thousands and thousands of Oxford/Astra doses sitting in fridges right across Europe.......the virus must be laughing at that thought.
I’m also getting the feeling that some of the BAME community want to be vaccinated on their own doorsteps.
Ref BAME: I was listening to an interesting radio prog about this. They were making the point that many of these families are deeply suspicious of what white people will inject them with. Many examples of experiments being carried out on black people without even mentioning it to them. Consequently, not keen to join the queue.
Also made the point that many such families are under the influence/guidance of elders; if the elders say "No", then everyone follows the leader. Unless authorities get through to the head of the household/family, they are wasting their time.

Ian
 
Coronavirus
Ref BAME: I was listening to an interesting radio prog about this. They were making the point that many of these families are deeply suspicious of what white people will inject them with. Many examples of experiments being carried out on black people without even mentioning it to them. Consequently, not keen to join the queue.
Also made the point that many such families are under the influence/guidance of elders; if the elders say "No", then everyone follows the leader. Unless authorities get through to the head of the household/family, they are wasting their time.

Ian

I could understand their concerns if the BAME community were being offered a different vaccine to everyone else but they’re not.
Not forgetting though, it’s not only the BAME community.....there’s others.
 

Mushroom

Member
Coronavirus
I could understand their concerns if the BAME community were being offered a different vaccine to everyone else but they’re not.
Not forgetting though, it’s not only the BAME community.....there’s others.
Look at the positive side. Those that don't want it will leave more for the rest and that should get through to the younger age groups quicker.
If we can't make people have the jab we should at least give them terms for things like isolating, social distancing and face masks etc.
Personally, if they were later to require NHS care for Covid related illnesses, I would apply charges.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
Showed a clip on the BBC about a vaccination centre somewhere in Belgium. It was geared up to deal with 500 people daily, 6 people had turned up......
There’s thousands and thousands of Oxford/Astra doses sitting in fridges right across Europe.......the virus must be laughing at that thought.
I’m also getting the feeling that some of the BAME community want to be vaccinated on their own doorsteps.

I am surprised you as a anti EU sceptic ( brexiteer ) are against Countries making Sovereign decisions , because ultimately, these decisions came down to individual Countries Health Authorities and their interpretations of available data. Yes, they may be wrong, but their own Sovereign decision.

Why these Countries decided not to recommend AZ was made was based on the information available at the time ( but companies continually update ) hence changes. .. The issue for some countries and their vaccine advisors , was they think/thought not enough of the AZ trial participants were aged over 65 to make conclusions on the vaccine's effectiveness. This is because there was only two of the 660 people in the AZ trial in that age group that participated ....

Whereas other companies, like Pfizer, included many more older people in their trials, so have more data available.

So it depended on the individual Scientists interpretation about how much evidence is needed for any new advance . They are not arguing, that the AZ vaccine is ineffective also NO countries is there any disagreement within all the Countries health regulators about the safety of the AZ vaccine.

People like the EMA and us "needing emergency use" the Scientists based their decision on being reassured BY the vaccine's effectiveness in the over 65s by looking at a different part of the data. Example, during clinical trials AZ vaccine was shown to stimulate an immune response in older age groups similar to that seen in younger people , with evidence of antibodies which could fight off the virus. It's normal for Scientists often to disagree as seen we have seen with those in SAGE.

What I do agree is the vaccine left, if true in Belgium, could be put to better use, given to the Covax Scheme donated to lower income countries.



 
Last edited:
Coronavirus
I am surprised you as a anti EU sceptic ( brexiteer ) are against Countries making Sovereign decisions , because ultimately, these decisions came down to individual Countries Health Authorities and their interpretations of available data. Yes, they may be wrong, but their own Sovereign decision.

Why these Countries decided not to recommend AZ was made was based on the information available at the time ( but companies continually update ) hence changes. .. The issue for some countries and their vaccine advisors , was they think/thought not enough of the AZ trial participants were aged over 65 to make conclusions on the vaccine's effectiveness. This is because there was only two of the 660 people in the AZ trial in that age group that participated ....

Whereas other companies, like Pfizer, included many more older people in their trials, so have more data available.

So it depended on the individual Scientists interpretation about how much evidence is needed for any new advance . They are not arguing, that the AZ vaccine is ineffective also NO countries is there any disagreement within all the Countries health regulators about the safety of the AZ vaccine.

People like the EMA and us "needing emergency use" the Scientists based their decision on being reassured BY the vaccine's effectiveness in the over 65s by looking at a different part of the data. Example, during clinical trials AZ vaccine was shown to stimulate an immune response in older age groups similar to that seen in younger people , with evidence of antibodies which could fight off the virus. It's normal for Scientists often to disagree as seen we have seen with those in SAGE.

What I do agree is the vaccine left, if true in Belgium, could be put to better use, given to the Covax Scheme donated to lower income countries.


So what’s the use of the EMA then Camden? They gave the green light to the Oxford vaccine.....are they surplus to requirements?
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
So what’s the use of the EMA then Camden? They gave the green light to the Oxford vaccine.....are they surplus to requirements?

No, why ? They are specialist dept of the EU set up to advise institutions and member state on their evaluation , supervision and central licensing of medicines, making them more affordable to people of the EU Chips.... you are not suggesting surely that EMA Advice should be compulsory ? overruling the Sovereign decisions made by the EU Countries Health Authorities.???? ........... that would be so unBrexit ... Nothing like your usual stance and policy of on leave .... Sovereignty
 
Last edited:
Coronavirus
Are you having a laugh or just being ignorant?
Vaccines sanctioned for use in the EU ie:
Pfizer.
Moderna
Astra/Zeneca.
Have all been sanctioned for use by the EMA (European Medicines Agency), THEY have licensed ALL of the above vaccines. Surely you’re not suggesting that Frances or Macrons findings supersedes an EUs institution? That licensing was for use in/across the EU.

The EMA did get it right, they’ve been accused of being slow but nonetheless they got there. Now it’s being changed to speed up their process.
Through baseless comments made, they now struggle to get the vaccine into people’s arms. Where was Brussels in stepping on Macron there and then, he challenged an EU Institution.....
Like Blair, Macron has just blown his shot at the EU Presidency IMO.
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
Are you having a laugh or just being ignorant?
Vaccines sanctioned for use in the EU ie:
Pfizer.
Moderna
Astra/Zeneca.
Have all been sanctioned for use by the EMA (European Medicines Agency), THEY have licensed ALL of the above vaccines. Surely you’re not suggesting that Frances or Macrons findings supersedes an EUs institution? That licensing was for use in/across the EU.

The EMA did get it right, they’ve been accused of being slow but nonetheless they got there. Now it’s being changed to speed up their process.
Through baseless comments made, they now struggle to get the vaccine into people’s arms. Where was Brussels in stepping on Macron there and then, he challenged an EU Institution.....
Like Blair, Macron has just blown his shot at the EU Presidency IMO.

Your swerve was expected ....as was the unanswered questions.

Who suggested that ALL the Vaccines hadn't been sanctioned or licenced by the EMA for use in Europe ? ( I know you don't like answering so just even paste the post that I ignorantly did suggest as accused ).........

What I said, and what I don't know what part you don't understand, the EU members Health Authorities are Sovereign in their decisions which would inc France .... and that includes use EMA sanctioned and licenced the choice is theirs to or not ....

and that issue was covered in my post

Camden said The issue for some countries and their vaccine advisors , was they think/thought not enough of the AZ trial participants were aged over 65 to make conclusions on the vaccine's effectiveness. This is because there was only two of the 660 people in the AZ trial in that age group that participated .... Whereas other companies, like Pfizer, included many more older people in their trials, so have more data available.
So it depended on the individual Scientists interpretation about how much evidence is needed for any new advance . They are not arguing, that the AZ vaccine is ineffective also NO countries is there any disagreement within all the Countries health regulators about the safety of the AZ vaccine.

The opinion of Sovereign national regulators in the EU exercising caution are changing all the time as more data emerges.The AZ developers say that results from a trial of 2,000 adults over 55 in the UK will soon be available, and another trial in the US in older age groups is close to providing data too.

As for Macron .... can you imagine Brexiteers when we were in the EU if a Sovereign countries leader as you suggest they do "stepped on" by Brussels ? ... Ohh... the howls of outrage....
 
Last edited:
Coronavirus
Your swerve was expected ....

Who suggested that Vaccines hadn't been sanctioned or licenced by the EMA for use in Europe ? ( I know you don't like answering so just even paste the post that I ignorantly did suggest as accused ).........

I don't know what part you don't understand but the EU members Health Authorities are Sovereign in their decisions which would inc France .... and that includes use EMA sanctioned and licenced the choice is theirs to or not ....

and that issue was covered in my post



As for Macron .... can you imagine Brexiteers when we were in the EU if a Sovereign countries leader as you suggest was "stepped on" by Brussels ? ... the howls of outrage....
You just don't get it......

Here's a little something for you to ponder over.
If Latvia (being an EU member state), now comes up with a Covid vaccine, what happens then.
Are they allowed to just supply it to all 27, do they need the French to license it or does it go to the EMA for testing and licensing?
 

Camden

Member
Coronavirus
You just don't get it......

Here's a little something for you to ponder over.
If Latvia (being an EU member state), now comes up with a Covid vaccine, what happens then.
Are they allowed to just supply it to all 27, do they need the French to license it or does it go to the EMA for testing and licensing?

So is it the case you can't answer ? nor it seems you can you paste the post of my alleged Ignorance you accused ?

Because what is the relevance of the above post ?

To answer........... Talking of Ignorance first it wouldn't be a country but a pharmaceutical company that would have to go before the EMA to get a license evaluation and authorised recommendation for sale or use in the EU, (unless a non prescription medicine which can be done solely nationally ) ... Which I have never denied ,even asking for a pasted post to show alleged ignorance accused .... Then it is left up to the Sovereign choice of EU countries Health Authorities regulators on its use or not and by who ,as seen ....
 

Latest Posts

Top Bottom